User talk:Mordecay/Archive02

Archived - 30. 08. 2018

Alpha

Hey, should it be alphabetical though? I think it's worth reconsidering. If the purpose of the section is to list the most notable members of that race, then it makes sense for the most important member of that race to be listed first. And to go from most notable (Nefarian..) to less notable (random, one-time quest givers). -- MyMindWontQuiet (talk) 12:27, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

Oh, I dunno, but u make a point, I guess. Just update the other dragon pages as well and it should be fine. --Mordecay (talk) 12:33, 7 June 2017 (UTC)

Our time here is ogre

Mh, the ogre clans of Kalimdor could have arrived before the Third War. The ogres were known shipbuilders, and the Old Horde ogres had to fuck off somewhere after their defeat... Xporc (talk) 10:42, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

Yea, likely. Feel free to expand it if needed. --Mordecay (talk) 11:03, 11 June 2017 (UTC)

Website lore

Hey, do we have the new Legion character pages on WoWpedia? -- MyMindWontQuiet (talk) 18:28, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

~~No. --Mordecay (talk) 18:34, 15 June 2017 (UTC)~~

Yes. --Mordecay (talk) 14:53, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

Maybe they could use some more work, like adding links to the relevant novels/etc. but nice work! Xporc (talk) 14:58, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

K. --Mordecay (talk) 15:00, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

I can do it later if you want. No need to give you all the workload Xporc (talk) 15:05, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

Sure, if u want. --Mordecay (talk) 15:37, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

Commander

Hey, where is Commander Taylor in Warlords? After a quick search the quest, the garrison, the NPC and the follower are all named Admiral Taylor. Was it at the very beginning or something? -- MyMindWontQuiet (talk) 19:09, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

[1] --Mordecay (talk) 19:13, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, Admiral Taylor was a commander, however his title was still Admiral, the article implied otherwise, should be changed. Thanks.-- MyMindWontQuiet (talk) 19:50, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Yea, u r right. --Mordecay (talk) 19:53, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Mh, it's interestings that he had the same title as adventurers, and that both of them commanded garrisons. Xporc (talk) 19:54, 15 June 2017 (UTC)

Blood knights

Oh, didn't see you changing it up there as the category was red for "Blood Knights". I was just changing a few of them back as I recalled seeing "Blood knights" before. What's the reason for the change? Just out of curiosity? I think we generally have most 2-word-classes with second word in lower case letters. PeterWind (talk) 12:50, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

I thought the organization should be Blood Knights instead of Blood knight. --Mordecay (talk) 12:52, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Ahh I guess, so Blood Knights as the organization/affilliation, and Paladin as their class/character? PeterWind (talk) 13:42, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Yep. But now I think I vaguely remember using blood knight as a class in the game... not sure. --Mordecay (talk) 13:44, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Works for me. Wish we had access to bots for this kind of work.

By the way, if you change the category from "Blood knights" (the class) to "Blood Knights" (the organization), every blood elf paladin should still be tagged, even those of Outland that are the enemies of the Silvermoon order. Xporc (talk) 13:47, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Tagged as? --Mordecay (talk) 13:55, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Blood Knights category Xporc (talk) 14:09, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Okay dude I started checking your work. You're actually de-tagging many people without even having a conversation about it. Considering I spent days on the blood knights page, I ask you to slow down and discuss this before going further Xporc (talk) 14:13, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Ok. Which ones?--Mordecay (talk) 14:14, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

All these Outland people you de-tagged. Why ask here to begin with if you decided to ignore it? Also I can understand the will to remove people with warrior abilities rather than paladin abilities, but I think these guys should still be tagged as Blood Knights. Why? Well, if we take a look at the draenei vindicators, several of them use warrior abilities instead of paladin abilities, but they are still vindicators. Paladin are people fighting in melee, just because one uses warrior-type abilities doesn't mean he should be counted as not a paladin. Xporc (talk) 14:19, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Do you think Captain Arathyn and Sharth Voldoun should have the category despite zero lore on them being Blood Knights? Or having the ranseur is enough to warrant it?
Blood Lord Zarath being a blood knight purely a speculation.
The wording about battlemasters in the Blood Knights page imply a speculation.
Saedelin Whitedawn zero lore on her. Or would it be ok to put all blood elven paladins into the Blood Knight category? --Mordecay (talk) 14:28, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

The ranseur is described as being the order's distinctive weapon. To me it's enough to tag someone as a blood knight, especially if they're wearing plate armor and using paladin abilities.

For Arathyn I can understand the doubt, but see what I said above about using warrior abilities
For Sharth Voldoun it's obvious he's a BK. Paladin abilities, ranseur, paladin armor.
For Zarath, well, he's having a Blood Knight title (see Illidari Blood Lord and Sunfury Blood Lord, he's riding a BK mount and wearing BK armor.
For the battlemasters, they are wearing blood knight armor while residing in the blood knight temple. Also almost all blood elf battlemasters were BKs, like Yula the Fair.
For Saedelin yes I believe all blood elf paladins should be put into the blood knights category, unless they belong to another paladin-training faction like the Argent Crusade. I also believe all death knight characters should be put into the Knights of Ebon Blade category unless they are from the Scourge or the Burning Legion as well, for example. It's not like the Cenarion Circle where you can have a night elf druid that never bothered with joining the faction. The lore of the Blood Knights and Death Knights is pretty specific about them being members of knight orders Xporc (talk) 14:41, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Although I don't agree with everything u said, I went back through my edits and re-added the category. The only page I did not add it is Malevus the Mad. --Mordecay (talk) 15:21, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Well the good thing is that with the "warrior character" and "paladin character" categories we can mix and match with "blood knight" as their affiliations instead wrongly putting someone who doesn't use any paladin ability as a paladin. Anyway ... My apologies if I sounded harsh or boring with this :( Now I feel bad Xporc (talk) 15:35, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

No need to! --Mordecay (talk) 15:45, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

I insist my dude. I should have been more polite, you amply deserve this Xporc (talk) 15:58, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

<3 <3 <3 --Mordecay (talk) 16:09, 18 June 2017 (UTC)

Citation on Sargeras Trivia

Hey! Don't 'citation needed' me, I just repeated what was said earlier in the article. Citation number 29. I don't actually know how to put citations in though. Meganerd18 (talk) 04:08, 19 June 2017 (UTC)

These like this --Mordecay (talk) 09:36, 19 June 2017 (UTC)

Warlock

Hi, Gul'dan killed only one warlock in the Tomb, Urluk, so there's no debating as to his identity. As for the placement the whole structure was changed so it's non-issue, lots of things changed, such as where Gul'dan himself actually died, the fact that the Chamber of the Moon is no longer roofless, and so on. -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:36, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

K. But the placement (and its change) can still be mentioned, no? --Mordecay (talk) 12:38, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Yeah definitely. -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:40, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Since I have not done the raid yet, there's also the possibility that the Sunken Stair is near the entrance of the Tomb, you just have to make a detour through the naga-infested areas. Maybe Gul'dan and his crew didn't had to make such a detour in their time. Xporc (talk) 12:44, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

There could have been other (secret?) hallways indeed. The Temple of Elune was huge, and a lot of priestesses lived there. It was not just a few semi-linear halls, I imagine in lore there were/are even more corridors etc. than that (even though they did a pretty good job with the Tomb, feels like a real place) and than what is featured in-game. -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:48, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

There were also at least 3 entrances from which Maiev's reinforcements from above entered. --Mordecay (talk) 12:51, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

PTR quests

Hey! It's great to see you adding the PTR quests! A good thing to know when dealing with Wowhead or WoW-DB, sometimes they'll have this #random-number in place of the items that they don't have in their database. While this isn't aaaalways the case, often those items will be in the Armory. meaning you can just copy/paste that ID there to find it. Copying the icon from the Armory is a tiny bit more "complex", but not too much. Simply using the "Inspect element" tool and mouse-overing the icon, will let you see the filename. As I enjoy working with item articles I don't mind working with that part at all, but you might find these "tricks" useful too, at least for adding the item names :) PeterWind (talk) 17:47, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Oh cool, had no clue those #random-number items can still be found! I'll use it at least for the name. --Mordecay (talk) 18:03, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Ice

Hey, would you have examples of mages using an ice elemental or at least a water elemental that has not the classic model, like for example the Bound elemental model? I'm sure I have seen some but I'd need exact names/references. Thanks. -- MyMindWontQuiet 22:15, 27 June 2017 (UTC)

Hey, I'm not sure about mages in particular, but the Twilight's Hammer been using some, such as this Bound Water Elemental, Bound Torrent or Crystalline Elemental. --Mordecay (talk) 13:25, 28 June 2017 (UTC)

Thanks! -- MyMindWontQuiet 07:14, 29 June 2017 (UTC)

Goblin model updates

The key thing with the goblin model update (and the original blood elf and worgen ones) was that unlike the WoD updates it can't be toggled off by a personal display setting. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 21:19, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

Alright then! Also forest trolls, yes? --Mordecay (talk) 21:20, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes. And ogres, since they all got a model update with Dire Maul in 1.3.0. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 23:55, 3 July 2017 (UTC)

Guess

It's because you hate me, I knew it! Xporc (talk) 20:47, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Exactly! --Mordecay (talk) 20:48, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Joke aside, I may have tagged the Orgrimmar Legion/Ironforge Brigade thing too hastily. It sounds pretty plausible to me than the Horde/Alliance NPCs in the area would be part of the two battalions, but I guess there's no proof? Xporc (talk) 20:55, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Exactly my thinking. They very likely are a part, but nothing (probably) states it. They "could" have been a part of "just" Alliance/Horde and not of the forces, but that is speculative just like categorizing them with the forces, methinks. --Mordecay (talk) 20:58, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Maybe just add a Speculation section to each army page with a list of potential NPCs that could belong to them, then? Xporc (talk) 21:00, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

That should work. --Mordecay (talk) 21:03, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Not sure if relevant, but the Silithyst guards were a part of the Silithus PvP thing while the Brigade/Legion represented the "story" part. Just a thought :D --Mordecay (talk) 21:13, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Shit lords

The Mannoroth thing about Azgalor. It was from the RPG, where it was told Azgalor was his lieutenant and took his position as legion military commander. Of course now it's moot since demons can rez at will Xporc (talk) 20:09, 12 July 2017 (UTC)

Anetheron and Mephistroth are the second and third highest-ranking dreadlords. Azgalor was the pit lord that was with Archimonde alongside Anetheron. That means something, even if you can't use the RPG to spell it out.--SWM24 48 20:13, 12 July 2017 (UTC)

oh ofc, should have thought of that.

Very probably, but without any further description it is kept vague, open for any interpretations. Given the same three reappeared on Draenor, they could also be a part of his personal guard and not necessarily on top in the Legion hierarchy or structure. We can't be 100% sure either is part of canon. Mordecay (talk) 09:44, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

AU

Here's the War Crimes alternate timelines thing. Alternate_timelines#War_Crimes -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:40, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

That doesn't mention the arcane. --Mordecay (talk) 15:44, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

I don't get it? Time magic is arcane magic. It's not Void, it's not Light, it's not Necromancy, it's not Nature or Fel, only Arcane is left. The_Schools_of_Arcane_Magic_-_Transmutation "Spells that manipulate time also fall into this category." "The Weavers are acanists who specialize in chronomancy; the art of weaving time" -- MyMindWontQuiet 16:03, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Now u mixing things, I think. Neither of these mention the arcane WITH the alternate universes, which I'm speaking about and which needs a source (from the page about arcane "create or access alternate timelines,{fact}") While yes, there's time and arcane's transmutation, there's no mentioning Kairoz's (or the bronze dragonflight's) use of arcane to get to AUs. He used the Vision of Time which he tinkered. But it is not stated whether he used the arcane or not when he worked with the Vision. --Mordecay (talk) 16:14, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

I wouldn't say it can create alternate timelines, but doesn't Khadgar and the Kirin Tor use arcane to access the MU from WoD-Draenor? --Aquamonkeyeg (talk) 16:36, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Hmm, yes, Khadgar created small portals in Frostwall & Lunarfall to Orgrimmar & Stormwind from which the troops came. That covers the "access" part, I guess.

Now that I'm thinking about it. Do the bronze dragons use the arcane too? --Mordecay (talk) 16:45, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Possibly with Chronicle, since time is not listed as a separate cosmic force (and they're obviously not using fel). Prior to that, time itself was described more as its own energy/essence. "The creatures of this isle have passed through time, and may carry with them some of its essence." and "Epoch stones are rare, crystallized temporal essence." --Aquamonkeyeg (talk) 16:52, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Exactly, there is not a Time category, there isn't a cosmic force called Time, Chronicle shows there are only 6 (or 7) types of magic. - MyMindWontQuiet 17:16, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

All those time elementals in Nighthold beg to differ.--SWM24 48 20:24, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

No, they don't. There are 6 Types (capital T, for a lack of a better word) of magic, that's word of god from Chronicle. Then there are sub-categories or whatever you want to call them. All the other "types" (lesser T) of magic fit into the main ones. For example Chronicle doesn't list blood magic. That's because it's not a "Type" (capital T: Arcane/Void/Fel..) of magic, blood magic is a subcategory of Life magic. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:28, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Good mention tho, their "time abilities" are of the arcane school and deal arcane damage. --Mordecay (talk) 21:34, 13 July 2017 (UTC)

Since this section is already about alternate universes: there are now less and less '(Warlords of Draenor)' redirect. Some pages have to be updated to delete all remaining traces of them however. Xporc (talk) 11:50, 18 July 2017 (UTC)

Templates

Let me guess, you're removing stuff from templates and then reverting your change because you're checking who links to this page? :p Xporc (talk) 18:02, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Yep, so that I can see only million pages instead of billion. --Mordecay (talk) 18:05, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Yeah it is annoying. -- MyMindWontQuiet 19:34, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

No longer guardian

Hey is there a source saying Ysera is no longer a guardian of the Dream? -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:51, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Yes. I added it there. Does Legion say she still guards it or is it just an assumption that "she is there, so she guards it"? --Mordecay (talk) 12:52, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

All I recall from DotA is that the druids were to protect the Dream from the Nightmare, nothing about Ysera never caring/protecting the Dream ever again. Well, not really an assumption, in Legion we summon her from, well, the Dream, and she's called the Emerald Queen and Lady of Dreams and aids us with the Dream against Xavius and can be seen in the Dream after the raid. -- MyMindWontQuiet 13:59, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Ysera says that druids will take care of the Dream and Nightmare instead of them, the green dragons, and that they will do better work now. Doesn't this imply that she no longer protects (or want to protect) it? I --Mordecay (talk) 14:09, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, I don't think it means she herself no longer cares. She was still in the Dream and I don't think she was just chilling doing nothing while everyone was running around protecting stuff. Specially since she does intervene when Cenarius is taken by the Nightmare, proof that she too is involved and not just the mortal druids. -- MyMindWontQuiet 14:41, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

K. --Mordecay (talk) 15:37, 23 July 2017 (UTC)

blizz

Hey (User:Xporc too), I just like to first create the pages and then paste all the templates and categories everywhere but thanks guys! -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:44, 25 July 2017 (UTC)

Ok, will give u some more time! :D --Mordecay (talk) 12:46, 25 July 2017 (UTC)

blackrock spire

Now that's weird, I fixed your ^[1] reference (used to be "Thrall Twilight of the") and, well, now it's fixed but it's not showing in the edit History. -- MyMindWontQuiet 14:22, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Oh, I noticed the error so I went to fix it as u can see from the history log, so probably we were doing it at the same time with me being faster :D --Mordecay (talk) 14:30, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

^ Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects

The King's Common

About languages - I'm really tired of people using gnomish when speaking about gnomes (example: "the gnomish city of Gnomeregan"), orcish when speaking about orcs (example: "the orcish pig farm of Grol'dom"), so I was thinking about moving these pages to something like Gnomish (language) and having gnomish simply redirect to gnome instead. Same thing for elvish, orcish, dwarvish, etc. Xporc (talk) 07:18, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

Sounds good. --Mordecay (talk) 11:11, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

Quest template

Thanks for the fixes to [45G] Leyline Feed: Ley Station Moonfall. I created that using the quest template link that appears on a new page, so you might want to make similar fixes to that template for the boilerplate stuff. -- SpareSimian (talk) 05:19, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

U did well on the page. --Mordecay (talk) 10:34, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

Tome of Valor

Hey! I was looking around a little and found this and this. First one has a completion text, while the other doesn't. This site also has info on the 1793 one, but not the 1794 one. Not sure if either of those really gives enough to make a page for the quest that was the source of the book. Figured I'd link you the pages anyway :) PeterWind (talk) 15:52, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Don't source content from that site. Private servers are Project:DNP. --Pcj (T•C) 15:54, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Yes, it was a completion quest like with the other tome I did yesterday. --Mordecay (talk) 16:04, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Ah, didn't know those database sites were affiliated with private servers. PeterWind (talk) 16:52, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

The databases take their info from wowhead, no? --Mordecay (talk) 16:55, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

No, it looks like WH and incorporates their comments where relevant but the items are those on their vanilla (private) server. Which may or may not be the same as OG Vanilla WoW, but that isn't the point anyway. --Pcj (T•C) 16:58, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Tremendous work these last weeks btw! Xporc (talk) 18:10, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Project:3RR

You're blocked due to the three reversions. If you're willing to discuss the changes to the article on the talk page rather than outright reverting me I'm willing to lift the block. --PcjWowpedia admin (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 12:45, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

I went ahead and removed the block as I probably reacted a little hastily. I do want to request your comments on the talk page so we can figure out the name though. --Pcj (T•C) 13:05, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Yay, my first ban ever! --Mordecay (talk) 19:46, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

You little scoundrel. Xporc (talk) 19:47, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

I will put my thoughts here as the intention of the revert wasn't to discuss a new name. So when reverting, I didn't realize the third revert rule (and forgot about it, tbh...). Of course, when doing that I had a reason. So my explanations below:

As I said in the summary section (which I should probably have said it here apparently) the name is not canon, for it to be canon it needs to be mentioned in the game or literature (by Blizzard) which has not. It is indeed as has been put "words strung together by a person", tho. That person was not Blizzard, it was a fan, meaning it is a fanmade name - even though it is a concise a "fitting" one. Words about "lore conflict" cannot be said here since that fan doesn't create lore. Blizzard does.

Regarding the box, tbh, I haven't been aware of all of its proper usage probably, but as Xporc (thanks for the good words, btw) mentioned how he understood its usage, this is how I, too, saw it for several years now, really. Its description and locations across the wiki kinda lean towards it. With descriptive names, when there's no official name, in my opinion, there should be something saying that it's not official/from Blizz, preferably at the top of articles (which the box seemed do a good job). And when (lore) articles have a descriptive name it is a good thing to differentiate between descriptive names used by Blizzard and descriptive names created by fans (such as the war in Outland and some more). Here's an example - ogre girl. We don't know her name, but she is referenced in the book and art as ogre girl several times. Here I think it is not necessary to incude that box because she is referenced as such by Blizz. If the book didn't address that character as "ogre girl" but the page would be created with that name, then I could imagine putting it there for people to know it's fanmade.

Hope that's clear and I'm still open to discussions but I will advocate for "something" to be put at the top of unofficially / fan named articles coz since I have spent so many years here I want wowpedia to be a decent & clear place. Even though wowpedia is not supported by Blizzard, we should support them by "archiving" their work properly.

And this conclude the 2 or not so 2 hours of freedom! :D --Mordecay (talk) 20:41, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Welcome back! Maybe copy-paste your thoughts on the relevant page? Xporc (talk) 20:58, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Oh, hey, long time no see! Sure, will have a look at it. --Mordecay (talk) 21:02, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Welcome back! :) PeterWind (talk) 21:03, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Thx! :D --Mordecay (talk) 21:36, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Hey what a rebellious bad boy you are ! -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:52, 21 August 2017 (UTC)

Indeed! --Mordecay (talk) 21:34, 21 August 2017 (UTC)

Project:BR

What is the reputation substitution being requested on the quest infobox? --PcjWowpedia admin (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 22:55, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

The point of the request was to fix Exodar to Exodar (faction) (all the main Horde and Alliance factions that use (faction) in the name, except the Bilgewater Cartel) in both instances, not this [2]. --Mordecay (talk) 23:07, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Well...that was a confusing bot request.--Pcj (T•C) 23:18, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Why? Affiliations should link to faction not to city. --Mordecay (talk) 23:21, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

I probably just mis-read it. --Pcj (T•C) 23:45, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Not that it's written in a best way either :D --Mordecay (talk) 00:11, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Are u aware of these [3] & [4] ? --Mordecay (talk) 00:25, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Yeah, I made a tweak mid-way through to take care of that where possible. Not worth going back to catch those though. --Pcj (T•C) 00:32, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Oke.--Mordecay (talk) 00:35, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Yo! Are we sure that the bot didn't introduced more problems like this and this? Is there a way to check easily? Xporc (talk) 07:45, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Pretty sure. It skipped those for the first run because it didn't match the pattern. I tweaked it and added them back to the list but it didn't take correctly. Only the second pass (<30) were affected in that manner. --Pcj (T•C) 12:41, 3 August 2017 (UTC)

Yo, Pcj! Did the bot do "faffiliation" too ?--Mordecay (talk) 20:07, 4 August 2017 (UTC)

No, it wasn't written to, anyway. --Pcj (T•C) 20:09, 4 August 2017 (UTC)

Nathreza in Chronicle

Under the word "Fel" It shows a fiery planet orbited by a solid dot followed by a series of white dots. That sounds like Nathreza. Though the Order side has a very similar planet that just is not on fire...--SWM24 48 03:13, 19 August 2017 (UTC)

Alrighty then! --Mordecay (talk) 11:48, 19 August 2017 (UTC)

Same model

I don't really see the use of calling out when NPCs with non-unique models share models with each other. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 19:59, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

Understood. Does it really hurt having it, tho? I could stop adding these if so since it is just a recent thing from my part, but I quite enjoyed checking the NPCs. I just thought it to be a nice note that maaaybe someone would be interested in. --Mordecay (talk) 20:26, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

I think it's cool and interesting when it's actually about unique looks, but I admit when it's about generic naga model I fail to see the point :D Xporc (talk) 20:47, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

Why did you remove the Jotek / Horde Field Scout thing? I think this kind of information was cool, for example Xporc (talk) 21:52, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

The palette the two naga use are (should be) used to those two, so that should be unique look, no? So I got confused by being generic as Jotek / Horde Field Scout use "generic" models too. --Mordecay (talk) 22:13, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

The thing is that Jotek and the Horde Field Scout had the exact same face, hair and armor set despite being entirely different NPCs. So that's something interesting and noteworthy, in my mind. Now, about the two naga sirens, were their color palettes unique to them? If so I guess the model is not generic anymore, but if it's a color palette used by several other generic naga mobs, it's not a unique appearance anymore. Xporc (talk) 07:57, 21 August 2017 (UTC)

Ok, I checked again and found two more naga using the same model as Valishj, so a mistake on my part. With other races it is indeed the body (face, hair and skintone) along with armor that is taken into consideration. They may wield different weapons tho.

EDIT: regarding Zeratul's question, maaaaaybe roleplayers would find it interesting? --Mordecay (talk) 11:03, 21 August 2017 (UTC)

Non-text dialouge

Only Uther laughs, not Arthas. Even so, including this will create a lot of problems. We'd have to go through all the missions and add all the other "emote" moments as well. For example, The Spirits of Ashenvale doesn't include Grom laughing after mentioning the dancing lights. Plus, there's the issue of this being fan-made script when it may be better to just have the official dialogue. --ShadowShade81413 (talk) 23:05, 22 August 2017 (UTC)

It seems to me that they both are laughing. No hard opinions on this, but maybe User:DeludedTroll would wanna say something? --Mordecay (talk) 23:17, 22 August 2017 (UTC)

WoW quest dialogues do have non-written emotes, though they don't use the emote template. It'd make sense to show when a character laughs. -- MyMindWontQuiet 01:15, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

I thought it was odd to leave it out, as I considered it to be important for the "flow" of the dialogue as well as the overall tone of Uther's comment in particular and that entire scene in general. But if it could cause problems and it's better to leave it out in favor of only sticking to the explicitly spelled out in-game text, then yeah, it's not a big deal. --

DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 10:02, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

There's no issue, it's also a common practice in WoW quests and scenarios. It'd just be a pain to go through all the missions and write them back down, but nobody's asking anyone (or just one person) to do it. -- MyMindWontQuiet 13:07, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

Permadeath on Argus

Hi, in the 7.3 trailer Illidan says every demon dying there dies their final death. -- MyMindWontQuiet 22:51, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Yep! How long till they retcon it? :D

Lol I totally forgot to ask. Who is the bring-them-down eredar? Talgath? --Mordecay (talk) 22:54, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Not Talgath, it's the Chief Engineer guy from the War Council boss fight ! The Antorus raid bosses make a few appearances throughout Antoran questing, for example the hounds are running around trampling everyone in their way during a WQ, and Portal Keeper Hasabel is a hologram that disappears after you kill the rare mob communicating with her. -- MyMindWontQuiet 19:57, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Okay. It is good to see the bosses outside of raids! --Mordecay (talk) 20:00, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Engine screaming

Hey, since you updated most of the naga, I noticed that there was a sort of recurring theme about them. A "Screamer" class, based on sonic warfare. Do you think it's worth it creating a page for them? Xporc (talk) 23:45, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

Not sure. Someone could argue (not me) that there is not enough info for the page. But hey, u r the boss now and I wouldn't mind it, even if it is a short one! This sonic theme seems interesting. --Mordecay (talk) 23:59, 25 August 2017 (UTC)

I'm not anyone's boss. At worst I am the J. Jonah Jameson-like dude, pointlessly yelling "I WANT PICTURES OF SYLVANAS" when I'm stressed out :D Xporc (talk) 00:02, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

She's a menace! PeterWind (talk) 13:34, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Wrathscale Sirens and Darkspine Sirens also use the screech ability. And the same ability is also used by a harpy which is called screeching and there are more screeching harpies with different abilities. --Mordecay (talk) 13:13, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Hey I think "screeching harpy" is redundant -- MyMindWontQuiet 19:59, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

That really is a lot of naga! Outstanding job adding them! PeterWind (talk) 00:29, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

Hehe, thx! --Mordecay (talk) 00:39, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

Mmh, most "Screecher" mobs seems to be gargoyles, bats or owls. That doesn't leave us with much to create a "Screamer" NPC class :/ Xporc (talk) 15:19, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

News

Hey buddy, are you doing alright these days? Xporc (talk) 07:14, 30 August 2017 (UTC)

Sure thing! U? --Mordecay (talk) 01:23, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Yeah! But I was worried something had happened to you, so I may or may not have stalked your twitter and battle.net accounts! Xporc (talk) 07:05, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Yeah we're also going to need your address, phone number, blood type, bank info and organ donor status. -- MyMindWontQuiet 09:47, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Oh, surely wowpedia needed a rest from the bazillion edits I made in previous weeks (just extra busy with school). Hehe, yep, I noticed u on Twitter. So is that u who added me on the blizz app too?

Okay MMWQ: Murder Row, Quel'Thalas, ask a gnome inventor or a far seer for that, felblood, 7 bag slots in the Bank of Silvermoon, necromancers haven't complained with my offerings. --Mordecay (talk) 11:17, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Yes it was me :( But I admit the rest was welcome, I could finally play some Starcraft! Xporc (talk) 11:32, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

That's ok, actually! --Mordecay (talk) 11:56, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

The Favored of Odyn

Hey there, got any idea why in-game the tablet only goes up to page two ? Same for The Legend of Odyn. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:46, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

Need more artifact research probably? Xporc (talk) 20:49, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

I don't think that's it; these texts went in when AK was still capped at 35 or 40, and even now that it's progressing weekly and automatically it hasn't changed. I think it's just legitimately NYI. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:54, 19 September 2017 (UTC)

When I created the pages I just took the content from Wowhead. Looking at Wowhead comments, it seems it was "nerfed" in 7.2 PTR http://www.wowhead.com/object=248981/the-favored-of-odyn#comments & http://www.wowhead.com/object=248980/the-legend-of-odyn#comments, but I'm not sure what was its status pre-72 aka if the tables were readable. --Mordecay (talk) 18:43, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

My main is a warrior, and I can confirm that these tablets have never been readable in-game. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:48, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Ah, okay. Then the pages need some cleaning. --Mordecay (talk) 18:57, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Turalyon & Alleria

So I guess T&A returning to Honor Hold, then disappearing 3 years after, is now officially retconned. I'm not sure it was necessary, that audio-drama could have taken place then. But it'd be a bit less dramatic. -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:49, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Yep, it is. I like that they explained (showed) the change, but yea them spending 3 years on Outland could work too, I guess. Now it is weird that the Honor Hold priest calls the world shattering event "a lost battle" when the Expedition actually secured the safety of Azeroth, tho he is a drunk so that may be a factor too! :D --Mordecay (talk) 15:43, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

I still need to know how the Army of the Light was created, and what's the relationship between Xe'ra and the other naaru, such as the Sha'tar and the Genedar ones. She apparently knows the Sha'tar because she knows about Tempest Keep. Velen knew about Xe'ra, and he had O'ros - Xe'ra's descendant - with him aboard the Exodar, before leaving Outland, wherever he comes from. -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:50, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

I need to know how Velen was able to recognize the Xenedar! --Mordecay (talk) 20:24, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

He definitely knew about Xe'ra, since he immediately recognized Light's Heart as being specifically her core. And he also knew her family, since he knew O'ros was her last descendant. Something's fishy. -- MyMindWontQuiet 11:07, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

I don't see the problem. The draenei of the Army of Light are draenei, not eredar. During the flight of the draenei a group of them left Velen's main group and joined Xera. Xporc (talk) 11:11, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Oh I'm not saying it's a problem at all. Just that I'd like to know the story. We don't know if Velen sent them to Xe'ra, or if Xe'ra found the draenei that were left behind, or if Xe'ra broke up with K'ure etc. because of their different ideologies and just took some draenei with her, etc. -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:16, 23 September 2017 (UTC)

Quick Question

When you mention past tense are you saying the section needs to be written in the past tense or that it's written as past tense and needs to change?--X59 (talk) 22:50, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Should be rewritten into past tense. --Mordecay (talk) 22:52, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Okay, thanks. I'll remember that when I'm adding to past sections that the information needs to be written in the past tense.--X59 (talk) 22:56, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Cool. --Mordecay (talk) 23:05, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Professions as classes

So now we have Category:Tinkers for engineers, Category:Alchemists for alchemists, Category:Medics for first aid practitioners, Category:Enchanters for enchanters... Are we missing something else? Xporc (talk) 12:32, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Regarding categories for practitioners of professions most of them are missing, I believe. There are the inscriber, smith and botanist pages that could go with associated categories. --Mordecay (talk) 12:49, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Well Skinning, Blacksmithing, Leatherworking, Tailoring, Herbalists, Inscription, Cooking, Fishing, Mining and Jewelcrafting are mostly civilian "jobs" so I don't really see a point to create categories for them.

Archaeology I guess I could see the usefulness of creating a category, for explorers and adventurers not members of the Explorer's League or the Reliquary. Same for the botanists, who are often druid-style mobs. Tinkers, Alchemists and Enchanters were RPG classes at least, and are also represented as mobs. Xporc (talk) 12:57, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Inscriber is also a RPG class. Medics and doctors (and alchemists) seem to me to be civilian jobs too, and they have their own category too. I don't mind either having or not having the rest of them. --Mordecay (talk) 13:13, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

There seems to be a few "Scribe" mobs, but no Inscribers AFAIK. Doctors and alchemists are also not what your average peasant might do, so I thought it'd be interesting to have a category for them... Anyway, guess for now we can fill the existing categories first and think about new categories later. Xporc (talk) 13:27, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Ah, right, there were two inscribers but they had their name changed to scribes. Agreed. Category for archaeologists sounds good tho. --Mordecay (talk) 13:39, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Someone help me, I'm supposed to be working, not creating new categories in a frenzy ;_; Xporc (talk) 13:51, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Please, continue! --Mordecay (talk) 13:56, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Noooooooooo Xporc (talk) 14:01, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

That mounted warriors category is getting pretty neat :D Xporc (talk) 15:30, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Yep! Do u like the name tho? It comes from RPG books. --Mordecay (talk) 15:53, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

The name is generic enough. I dont see better alternatives Xporc (talk) 18:25, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Ended up caving in. There are actually many fishermen/skinner/archeologist/miner/scribe/blacksmith mobs and NPCs all over the world. Current setup is:

Alchemy --> Category:Alchemists
Archaeology --> Category:Archaeologists (and Category:Explorers)
Blacksmithing --> Category:Blacksmiths
Cooking --> Category:Cooks
Enchanting --> Category:Enchanters
Engineering --> Category:Tinkers
First Aid --> Category:Medics
Fishing --> Category:Fishermen
Herbalism --> Category:Herbalists
Inscription --> Category:Scribes
Mining --> Category:Miners
Skinning --> Category:Skinners
Tailoring --> Category:Tailors

We should also probably do a "Cloud serpent riders" category, and ~~maybe~~ a Commoners one that would encompass peasants, peons, the various settlers and commoners of Warcraft III to WoW. Xporc (talk) 12:09, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Couldn't cloud-serpent riders go into Category:Riders's Dragon riders subcategory ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:36, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Probably, but since we already created categories for bats, wyverns, gryphons, dragons and all, we might as well go all the way and have also cloud serpent riders... also, nether ray riders? :p Xporc (talk) 12:42, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Is this missing anything? Xporc (talk) 13:56, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Think that's all of them yeah. PeterWind (talk) 16:38, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Really nice work. Now onto filling them! --Mordecay (talk) 21:11, 28 September 2017 (UTC)

Runeblade

I really don't think that is a relevant piece of trivia. Should we put this under every single article about a runeblade ? Should the Felo'melorn page note that it's not a death knight runeblade ? Not all runeblades are related to death knights, so I don't really see the point. For example elves too have runeblades. Should we also add that it's not an elven runeblade ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 10:27, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

I just wanted to have a link to the runeblade page as it wasn't there prior to that note. I don't care about the dk part of the sentence tho. --Mordecay (talk) 10:32, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Sure ! Unrelated, but image previews opening on your page when clicking on a picture are a new thing, are they not ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 10:40, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

pcj added it recently, yep Xporc (talk) 10:44, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Yep, noticed that yesterday. --Mordecay (talk) 10:46, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Do you know if there is a patch notes of sorts of the CSS changes and new functionalities that were added ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:33, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

You can often see pcj messing with the css in the Recent changes Xporc (talk) 12:41, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Crane Wing

Technically you broke the pages by making them about "Hopeless Monks" and "Crane Wing Monks" in a single page, could you fix them please? Same for the other Xporc (talk) 11:44, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Oops, thought I was doing Crane Wing versions. --Mordecay (talk) 11:53, 3 October 2017 (UTC)

Notable and types

Just curious, but is there any particular reason for why you've been combining "Notable" and "Types" sections into one? I personally think it makes more sense to have "actual characters with proper names or unique titles" and "generic mobs that have multiple identical copies of themselves running around" as separate sections (I also think it looks somewhat nicer on the page and in the page's table of contents.) Though I suppose this is a more a matter of arbitrary taste than anything. Edit: Also, I think it makes more sense to use a "Notable" header rather than a "Named" header to denote unique mobs, since there are some one-of-a-kind mobs who only have a unique title as their name rather than an actual proper character name (e.g. Sun-Touched Speaker, Time-Lost Proto Drake). -- DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 19:01, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

Hmm, yea, I do change Notable headers into Named because, I like its "neutral" sense better. And "Notable" header could probably imply more possibilities for notability, as in notable in the story for example, IMO.

For the combining, I create subsections, as in Members being the main section with Named and Units being its subsections, which, again personally, look nicer in the structure of a page, and make more sense to have two subsections with mob lists rather than two main sections of mobs in a page. Hopefully, this is what u meant by combining :D If not could u show me an example of this combining? --Mordecay (talk) 20:35, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

I'm not sure how you guys want to do this, but I'll agree with Mordecay in that 1 section is better than 2 specially on the Table of Contents. This section can then be divided into the subsections you settle one but, yeah, separating lists (sections) of characters looks weird to me. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:54, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

I don't have too strong an opinion on this one, although I lean more towards what DeludedTroll is saying. PeterWind (talk) 21:15, 5 October 2017 (UTC)

Alien

Hey there quick question, why did you add nerubian to the Alien templates ? They were born on Azeroth. -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:52, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

I added two types of nerubians to the other types. But yea, nerubians probably shouldn't be there. --Mordecay (talk) 15:56, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

They were probably put there originally because Old Gods are aliens. Xporc (talk) 17:09, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

I'm the one that put the aqir and n'raqi races there, and yeah, my reasoning was that it made sense for them to be listed next to the Old Gods from which they originate, even though they spawned after the Old Gods arrived on Azeroth. But, I suppose it could make more sense to have them on the natives template; I don't really care too much either way. --

DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 17:17, 15 October 2017 (UTC)

Capitalization

I've noticed that you tend to put infobox titles in lowercase. Titles/headers are always capitalized unless it's an article or coordinating conjunction that is not the first word. So why do you lowercase it? I'm genuinely curious, is there some weird rule I don't know about? :I – WarGodZajru (talk) 22:10, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

In the case of the infested in the infobox, it is not a proper name so it doesn't need to be in upper case. Section headers also shouldn't be in upper case unless it is a proper name. Not sure it is in the policies here, but I vaguely remember someone telling me this like that a while back. --Mordecay (talk) 22:19, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

It is a proper name though, "The Infested" encompass anything that has been infested by the Botani in some way or another, not just orcs but that is the only example we have in-game. But uh, section headers tend to go under this rule as well. Not saying either is wrong, though, being the thing I'm used to I feel the way I described how "it works" is just more visually appealing. Nonetheless, I decided to do some research on the topic and apparently it varies a lot. So it turns out neither is wrong. Well then. Interesting thing I noticed though was that most blogs and university sites I looked up do it as I've described but when actually looking at wikis, it does as you described, lol. – WarGodZajru (talk) 22:35, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Source for it being a proper name? I found it like that only in the blizzard blog referenced on the page, but looking at the other headers, they used the capitalization with other races as well and Wowpedia "ignores" it and puts it into lower case because race terms are 90% not proper names. In the quests and UVG it is written as the infested.--Mordecay (talk) 22:41, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Oh I meant it more as, a proper name to be capitalized in a title, lmao. Yeah, I know it's written as "infested" in text, so is "troll," "human," and so on, race names in WoW fluctuate between upper case and lower case though for the past few years, lower case has been the most prominent. Doesn't mean "human" shouldn't be capitalized in a title though, same with "infested." Y'know? – WarGodZajru (talk) 22:51, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Vol'jin is dead

Dude, Vol'jin is definitely dead. Thrall carrying his ashes or not, that doesn't mean anything. However, if there is something I'm missing, please let me know ASAP. : – User:CaptDeadeyeMC (talk) 18:01, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Talk:World of Warcraft: Battle for Azeroth --Mordecay (talk) 23:03, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

[45] Crystal Clearing and friends

As far as I can tell, Moonshade and Sendath's quests are actually neutral. Wowhead marked them as Alliance and Horde respectively for some reason, but I distinctly remember doing all of them on the same character. I could quest through Suramar on another character and re-check. - Linneris (talk) 05:24, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

Haven't done them so it could be possible. --Mordecay (talk) 11:48, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

I suppose they DO belong to each faction but yeah, you comeplete quests for both of them. PeterWind (talk) 13:03, 18 November 2017 (UTC)

Killable vs Defeatable

I see you've reverted my edit on Xavius. My idea was to remove the inconsistency. Such pages as Archimonde and Kil'jaeden use the word "Defeatable". Should it be the old "Killable" instead, in your opinion?--Adûnâi (talk) 22:12, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

Archimonde and Kil'jaeden have the defeatable word because we don't kill them. Both die in the cinematic that plays once defeated. We personally kill Xavius and Kael. What other pages have the defeatable word? --Mordecay (talk) 22:15, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

I didn't know about this convention. The fact that older entries don't use "ExpansionName-inline" appeared like an overlook. Thanks for clarifying!--Adûnâi (talk) 22:23, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

By the way, I appear to be ultimately right. Tichondrius doesn't die in a cinematic, yet is "Defeatable." It's so inconsistent.--Adûnâi (talk) 23:11, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

He is defeatable because his soul returns to the Nether so he is not killed but merely defeated. --Mordecay (talk) 23:15, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

Pantheon

Hey there, I'm wondering if you really think that the Dark Pantheon needs its own page ? Because it would basically be a few lines long. Also it would literally just be the Pantheon but raised back to life. Not even talking about the fact that it actually never came to existence as we stopped Sargy before he could even do anything. So it'd basically be a short article about something that didn't exist and that concerns the same people as the already existing Pantheon page. Wouldn't it thus be better as a section of the Pantheon article or something ? Kind of like Dark Ancients. -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:15, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

A subsection in the Pantheon would be ok methinks. --Mordecay (talk) 23:17, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

I'd agree. The Dark Pantheon is just Sargeras trying to corrupt the Pantheon, whereas the Dark Ancients were actually a separate group of beings. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 23:24, 23 December 2017 (UTC)

Mobs and missions

Man you've really been on fire these last few weeks with the mobs and the missions! Well done! :) PeterWind (talk) 18:46, 27 December 2017 (UTC)

Hehe thanks! It's funny how I was initially against the plain mission mobs, tho! :-D --Mordecay (talk) 21:31, 27 December 2017 (UTC)

Highmaul

Hey, since you want to create a page for MU Highmaul clan, could you please also update all links wrongfully pointing to Highmaul clan (alternate universe)? Xporc (talk) 14:22, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

Couldn't a bot do it? AFAIK, there are no links for the MU version right now. --Mordecay (talk) 14:38, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

Removed NPCs

Hey. Could you please stop putting "unknown" as the location of removed NPCs and mobs? Especially when removing geographical coordinates that will be relevant again in classic servers. Xporc (talk) 15:11, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Ok. Will try to remember that. --Mordecay (talk) 16:36, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Thanks :D Xporc (talk) 21:45, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

RE: A Vision of Triumph

There is no follow-up to the quest because although it is categorized under Shaman Campaign, it is completely separate from the quest chain and story. It's just a quest rewarding you with a gear piece because you reached a certain milestone with your artifact weapon.

Same goes for other class variants such as [45] Axe and You Shall Receive. -- Alayea (talk / contrib) 19:18, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

Oh, okay! Was confused when I saw it as the first quest under level 110. --Mordecay (talk) 19:25, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

corpse

Hey what do you mean by "his corpse was added to the Barrens but not seen" ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:15, 3 February 2018 (UTC)

Eh, I worded it poorly, I guess. I was responding to your comment that both instances were added when 735 hit live. When I responded "Added, but not seen" I meant that not both were seen when it hit live, but only the corpse was there since launch. --Mordecay (talk) 21:25, 3 February 2018 (UTC)

So both were added with 7.3.5, but only the corpse was visible. Then, the NPC was made visible (with the allied races questlines I guess ?). Correct ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 14:00, 4 February 2018 (UTC)

Yep. --Mordecay (talk) 14:11, 4 February 2018 (UTC)

No

Could you maybe explain instead of reverting every edit with just "No." ? That's hardly the way to work on a wiki. -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:39, 16 February 2018 (UTC)

Citation needed

Heya. You've been doing a great job updating the wiki, please keep it up. I'm grateful to all of our editors doing the grunt work of expanding articles.

However, I'm concerned by the liberal {{fact}}-tagging for what appears to be innocuous claims.

This appears to be a pattern. Is there a particular rationale?

I'm not arguing that we shouldn't cite our claims or our sources, but I'm concerned that every article is going to have a {{fact}} tag every other word at some point.

Anyway, thanks again, please keep up the good work. --k_d³ 21:56, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

As a hard follower of canon lore, I just want to have everything properly cited.

Previously, the village term was sourced as being from the non-canon RPG book so I was curious whether it had any canon mention.

The same with the skeletons. Yes, the are skeletons but are those three words put together by fan or by Blizzard? The tag was there for years and suddenly it's ok? --Mordecay (talk) 22:04, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

I think you're being too pedantic. The fact tag is typically for whole statements of questionable origin, not for whether not exactly the precise terminology is being utilized.

With regards to those specific examples, I don't think it needs sourcing anywhere that villages are a canon thing. Nor does it need sourcing that a wind serpent skeleton is called a skeletal wind serpent, given that it's a literal description of what it is. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 02:05, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

The problem is, if you don't explain what you mean when you add a {{fact}} template, it often feels like you're just saying "okay, now you guys prove that this place is a village, and not a municipality, neighborhood, borough, small town, hamlet, burg, district, township or kibbutz". For example, this edit and this one were pretty unnecessary IMO. We keep adding {{fact}} and {{Citations needed}} templates, which are disruptive for readers, but not so much do we actually remove them.

For the skeletal wind serpent thing, typically if the page was named "Sons of Sethe" or something while being unsourced, I think the fact template would be necessary. Not so much with the current name. Do we need a reference to prove that all dogs are called dogs in the Warcraft universe?

For the war in Draenor,^{[citation needed]} I think a whole war is important enough to deserve a tag saying that it has no canonical name yet. Yet being a key distinction, as I don't think we'll ever get a better canonical name for skeletal wind serpents. Xporc (talk) 08:33, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

To Zeratul, more like that a certain X is a village or town not that villages are canon. Yep, tho, I'm pedantic regarding sources.

As there's a small difference between a village and a town I just wanted a source where it was called a small town. I don't see why would that be a problem. And regarding the Stranglethorn I already said it was my bad, so no need to bring it up back, I double checked it later.

I don't think "importance" or what anyone is thinking of Blizzard ever naming a thing should play a role for it, but I can go the undead skeletal serpents go. --Mordecay (talk) 11:58, 2 March 2018 (UTC)

Charlga Razorflank

Thank you for providing the correct numbers. That's all I was looking for. :) — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 00:04, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

Np, should have added the numbers immediately, was just preoccupied with checking various sources. I was even using the number before that on a different page, tho :-D --Mordecay (talk) 00:08, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

Shadreen

Are you sure? I heard the rumor as well, but I haven't seen it for my self. I'm done with the event on all four armor types and I stayed behind every time without it happening. Are there screenshots of this happening? PeterWind (talk) 17:31, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Oh, I'm not sure. Info seen and taken from wowhead and SoL. --Mordecay (talk) 17:34, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Right. I'm putting a fact-flag untill we know for sure that it's more than hearsay :) PeterWind (talk) 17:57, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

~~What about it being done on a void elf?~~ --Mordecay (talk) 20:41, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Done it a second time, and the conversation triggered - File:Shadreen Proof.jpg. --Mordecay (talk) 21:16, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Looks like I have some apologies to issue, uugh. So it's only when you play velf? Xporc (talk) 21:17, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Dunno, both times I was there I was on velf, but it only showed the second time. I wasn't a winner (1.st, 2.nd or 3.rd) on both attempts. --Mordecay (talk) 21:20, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

Maybe it's any allied race? Maybe only velf? All I know is I went there 10 - 15 times or so to get the 4 new outfits and it didn't trigger once. Could just be exceedingly rare. Nice to see it backed with proof now. None of the other places I had seen the rumor had any screenshots. PeterWind (talk) 21:39, 8 March 2018 (UTC)

World quests

Hey, do you have any opinion on how we should deal with world quests, in terms of whether or not to include the progress numbers? Like with [10-44B] Retake Faronaar as an example. Killing the named mobs will give you 25% of the progress it seems. But the quest, of course, doesn't outright tell you to go and kill the same guy 4 times. PeterWind (talk) 18:09, 9 March 2018 (UTC)

Oh, and there's also the cases where databses list objectives such as kill x amount of "kill credit proxy" something or the other. Should we leave those lines in, or just remove those? PeterWind (talk) 18:18, 9 March 2018 (UTC)

Hey, not really. What I've done so far for the wq is that I would just list all the mobs associated in the Notes section instead of the Objectives one. I've never thought about the numbers. --Mordecay (talk) 18:26, 9 March 2018 (UTC)

Sounds reasonable. I'm just wondering how much editing I should do in the text that the databases present, seeing as you don't see it written that way ingame anyway. I think I'll largely leave the pages as-is for now, based on the editor toolkit. PeterWind (talk) 18:30, 9 March 2018 (UTC)

W3 & Chronicle

Ok I see the retcon, but I'm not sure what you're tryint to do with the "Convincing the humans was found to be difficult. He had more luck with Thrall and his new Horde." line because it basically repeats the same thing the next paragraph says.

As for The Search for Illidan, I think we should be taking a more lore-focused stance on the template. "Sentinels" had referred to all night elves in WC3, for example Malfurion is listed as a member of the Sentinels in the manual. Chronicle 3 makes it pretty clear it's just Maiev and the Watchers. And I think The Naga are probably listed as blood elves for gameplay reasons so they attack together smoothly during the mission. As long as this is made note of, we should use the real factions in the template. --ShadowShade81413 (talk) 01:20, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Oh, I just thought it would be help with transition from humans to orcs. It is, after all, Chronicle's words.

Not much experience with mission pages but I thought those templates should probably focus more on gameplay with lore being noted as such. --Mordecay (talk) 09:59, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Since we know Maiev isn't affiliated with the Sentinels, do you mind if I remove that? --ShadowShade81413 (talk) 02:50, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

Maiev wasn't affiliated with the Sentinels. It was the units. Since it is mentioned in Notes section, I think it should be ok to remove it from the infobox. --Mordecay (talk) 05:15, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

Alpha wowhead

Yeah Wowhead isn't too reliable this alpha. Or well not 100% in any case. Same with Gary Cofferdam. Wowhead still has nothing on that last name, yet that's how he appears in game. Lithia Grindstone also apears with a different name and as another race, yet there's only one NPC with that title. I'll assume it's the same, but I can't check up on it as I can't check NPC IDs with macros or addons yet. PeterWind (talk) 20:40, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Oki, thx for the response. --Mordecay (talk) 22:13, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Mistake became canon

Lol well if I misread Wolfheart and they just went with it it is pretty funny. I assure you I am in no way using Wowpedia to influence Blizzards lore. Or am I? lol Still, Knaak should have made his intentions clearer then if that's not what they intended.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 02:29, 20 April 2018 (UTC))

It is a sentence easy to misread, indeed. Well who knows what they intended as the latter development of the Watchers in WoD and Legion kinda doesn't hint at the book and honestly, it is just one big mess.--Mordecay (talk) 10:42, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

[Storming Stormwind]

I don't see anywhere in-game that this quest is called Storming Stormwind. I only see The Stormwind Extraction. I wanted to check in before moving to rename the page. -- Alianin T • C 18:05, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

It was called Stormwing Stormwind when it first came out. It was recently updated and it may have been renamed, indeed. Feel free to do it, if so. --Mordecay (talk) 18:08, 20 April 2018 (UTC)

Battle for Lordaeron

Hey. I see you have a link to a "Void Elf (BfA)". This here page on wowhead is called "Void Elf" on the site but "Ren'dorei Ranger" in game. The same NPC you mentioned? Just in terms of editing the quest page I mean. PeterWind (talk) 12:30, 21 April 2018 (UTC)

Last weekend I saw a video where the void elf that spawns with Alleria's portal and gnomes is called Void Elf. Is it now called Ren'dorei Ranger? --Mordecay (talk) 12:33, 21 April 2018 (UTC)

I plan on running the scenario multiple times. First time here I did not actually see them spawn as I was taking pictures elsewhere. I only know that the ingame name for the wowhead page I linked is "Ren'dorei Ranger". PeterWind (talk) 12:37, 21 April 2018 (UTC)

Redundancy

This is a minor thing, but there are certain cases where a title *is* an occupation, and vice versa. You have to discern between those cases, and cases where a person who leads the army of the ants is called "Great Ant Guy" (title = Great Ant Guy, occupation = leader of the army of the ants).

Even in cases where the occupation is capitallized, it shouldn't be duplicated (go to this president's page, you'll see that under "Occupation" he doesn't have every single one of his titles listed again, "President of the United States" and so on are not listed again, even though it's also an occupation, because that's pointless, they just kept "real estate developer").

In this case, you are making it redundant. It's already stated that Aggramar was/is the Former Champion of the Pantheon, there is no reason to put that twice, it's duplicating information in the Npcbox for no reason. -- MyMindWontQuiet 19:51, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Looking at several other pages, let's say Thrall's, where he is listed as warchief and leader and both of those are listed in the title parameter as well. The same holds true for many faction leaders. So no, I'm not making it redundant, it is as it has been in use since ever, again... --Mordecay (talk) 19:55, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

1 - If "several other pages" which were written 10 years ago started with "Wowpedia is turtle food" should we keep writing that on every new page, or do we realize at one point that it's weird to start every page with that sentence, and that we should probably should stop doing it ?

2 - I'm not making it redundant, it is as it has been since ever"

Yes it is redundant, and correct, it is as it's always been. These two sentences are not mutually exclusive.

3 - Anyway, I'm a reader. I'm looking at this page and I'm seeing that Wowpedia is calling Aggramar the Former Champion of the Pantheon twice, for seemingly no reason. As a reader (but also editor) I don't really care what "several other pages" did. I just know that I'm being presented with the same bit of information twice. If the only reason for that is "other pages did it", it's not a good reason.

(PS : regarding the Thrall example, it should probably be title=Warchief [of the Horde], occupation=leader of the orcs/Horde/etc., something like that) -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:11, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Since redundancy can be sometimes subjective, ask on the forum. Having such a small thing twice (when clearly one shows as title and second as job) isn't really that harmful, IMO. Actually, the Magazine, the Chronicle nor the UVGs use the Champion of the Pantheon as title so... --Mordecay (talk) 20:46, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

It's not just that, it's the entire Occupation section that is literally a duplicate of his Title one. (And Aggramar's lucky, he only had 2, there are pages where the same thing happens but you got like 13 repetitions.)

I don't think I mentioned anything about "Champion of Sargeras". -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:01, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Corrected. --Mordecay (talk) 21:03, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Funny I was actually looking at Trump's wiki page when writing response. So, you want something like this? --Mordecay (talk) 21:15, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Hmm I think so yeah.

Looking at it earlier, I'm wondering if having a |foccupation parameter (like faffiliation etc.) wouldn't solve a few things either -it's a bit odd syntaxically to have "Thrall's current occupation is former(ly) [something]". -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:23, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Now I wouldn't be opposed to that. It would look cleaner. --Mordecay (talk) 21:29, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

Spaces

Hello. The other day, you told PeterWind that editing a page simply to transform "Category:Tauren" into "Category:Tauren characters" was only bloating the RecentChanges page list, which I agree with. However, such edit are similarly unnecessary. Xporc (talk) 11:11, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

K. --Mordecay (talk) 11:13, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Dude. 1, 2, 3 stop. Xporc (talk) 13:35, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Use brain as to what was the reason I did that. Thx :* --Mordecay (talk) 13:36, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Spaces. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 13:42, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Bingo! An extra space after * creates an extra space after the first parenthesis. --Mordecay (talk) 13:44, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

The reason spaces were added in the first place is to provide readability for editors. Hence the reason you reverted 99% of my edit for Help:Mob articles/Preload — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 15:13, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Not sure, do you agree with the readability, or not? Because in the infoboxes, I do, hence the revert.

Will try to look for an admin previous response regarding space after *, if I don't forget. And again, you just put an extra space after the parenthesis so it is like: ( text) which is not ok which also Ryon has been fixing in the templates too so... u too use brain :* --Mordecay (talk) 15:21, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Instead of fixing all the templates just to get rid a single space after a parenthesis, how about removing it from the main template ({{Navbox}}) instead of going through thousands and thousands of templates... u too should use a brain, if you have one. :* — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 15:33, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Which I can do nothing about the navbox template, and importantly, I mentioned the extra parenthesis space before and nobody... noticed or cared? Only Ryon continued to apply it in his zone works. You gonna revert them too to just prove your pointless point? :* --Mordecay (talk) 15:42, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Pointless point? No. You talk with an administrator and ask them about it instead of just mentioning... somewhere... and expecting a message. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 15:47, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Yes, u r supposed to laugh at the word choice since we are discussing asterisks! :P --Mordecay (talk) 17:12, 30 April 2018 (UTC)s

There shouldn't be a space between the '(' and the 'B' in "(Battle for Shar'gel)". Now as for spaces before and after parameters in NPCboxes etc., they are not visible to the users so really nobody cares. -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:33, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Well, editors for clearer readability care. --Mordecay (talk) 15:43, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

These edits are pointless to do, it is just a space. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 15:49, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Which in the end do nothing so, their absence shouldn't be such a big deal, no? --Mordecay (talk) 17:12, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

I don't think any editor cares about whether there's 2, 4 or 8 spaces before/after parameters. I'm just saying in any case it does not hurt readiblity (it's lack of space that hurts readibility), I'm not saying you are forbidden to change that (in fact editing/asking someone to edit the Navbox template would probably be a good idea). -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:51, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Also, guys, since xporc entered into this discussion with the peterwind case you know that he goes into a state where he edits only infoboxes (especially the positions elements) and removes the space in headers which ultimately results in nothing for the readers as well, and he has been doing it for a long time. Now that I mentioned it doesn't mean I don't like it, I can only give a fudge about these types of edits. So I was called basically on the same thing even tho I "do" that what, 90% less than him? Even if I do remove space I mostly try to look at a page as a whole so I end up editing more not just the thing xporc mentioned in his first comment. So please, guys, don't bother me with such petty things no more. --Mordecay (talk) 18:54, 30 April 2018 (UTC)

Description

Official in-game descriptions should get their own section rather than being used as quotes on a faction's page. The Legion reputations did it wrong, doesn't mean the BFA reps should follow that. Having their own section also makes it more obvious for the readers and allows for easier intrawiki linking for editors. I'm going to fix this for all factions so don't need to worry about inconsistency !-- MyMindWontQuiet 13:31, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Just because it (putting it in a section) was just thought about doesn't mean that the current ones (also 1 of WoD and some of MoP) are wrong. Just what is wrong? Not easier to add it as a link, for sure.

However, as long as it is done on the other pages, it should be OK.

Anyhow, looking at some more pages, it is inconsistent as several articles have the description in the first / second sentence of the intro paragraph. --Mordecay (talk) 13:42, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Then fix it. :4Head: — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 13:56, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

On Argus, she is still a member

What do you mean ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:16, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Lothraxion says that he serves in the Army under Alleria. She is still listed as a secondary leader in the Army page. In the game she is tagged with the Army rep. --Mordecay (talk) 15:21, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

The army page was written by editors as well. Good point about Lothraxion, though. I feel like him saying that in 7.0 does contradict the short story published in 7.3 however, he couldn't serve her if she left the Army 500 years ago and then got imprisoned in jail by Xe'ra. But eh. -- MyMindWontQuiet 15:29, 11 May 2018 (UTC)

Chill down

Okay, I get you're still annoyed at the Hyjal thing, but please chill down a bit the edit warring with Surafbrov. He's been told to tone it down as well on Slack, FYI. Xporc (talk) 16:43, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

I'm having fun what about Mr. Noun? --Mordecay (talk) 16:48, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

I'm having fun with you. Now don't get your twat in a knot. :) — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 16:51, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

we just told to stop provoking. Xporc (talk) 16:52, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

That's love! --Mordecay (talk) 16:56, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Disgusting. Hob knocker. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 16:57, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

<3 <3 <3 --Mordecay (talk) 17:04, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Lunarglow Sword

My problem with adding that to the frost wolf page is that there are 20+ NPCs called "Frost Wolf". The item only drops from 2 of them, with 1% based on just over 1k kills, and 0,3% based on just over 20k kills. The one with the best chance is the frozen wolves that are only reachable through a quest or event. PeterWind (talk) 07:11, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Fair enough. --Mordecay (talk) 09:30, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Quotes

I've noticed that when you add quotes to NPC pages (like here, for instance), you oftentimes put it as plain text without including formatting like say or yell. As far as I know, if an NPC quote is displayed in-game as a /say, /yell, /whisper, or /emote, the formatting on the Wowpedia page should reflect that, and plain text should be reserved for text from gossip/dialogue windows, just to make clear in what context the quote is spoken. -- DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 08:40, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, okay, will try to start doing it. --Mordecay (talk) 09:30, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

They're weird

Hi, you added the sentence "They act weird" to these two articles (here and here), which is a weird sentence, at least without context. Could you develop/explain why/how they are weird ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 12:30, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Done. --Mordecay (talk) 12:36, 4 June 2018 (UTC)

Moving pages based on how recent they are

Okay, I know I once gave you permission to do it, but I think it's better to stop doing it. For example, in this edit, you changed the name of the Goblin Shredder, but you forgot to update other pages that you had previously moved to point to "Goblin Shredder (Battle for Azeroth)". This leads me to think that such moves are unnecessary, especially if you don't keep track of everything you move :( Xporc (talk) 09:19, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Oh, I just kept it like that because there are more non-event NPCs with that name in BfA but yea, I should have added the event ones there too, but I think I would have done it when the NPC pages would be created. But thinking about it, it is probably still early to say which non-event npcs will get separate pages I guess. I mean like the npcs of Legion when there is one silver hand knight page but he is present across 5 zones or so. Can go through the pages again and change that if needed. I did update them in the relevant quest pages tho so I did not forget. Also, the orgrimmar grunts having separate pages for the event yay or nay? Mordecay (talk) 09:56, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Mmh. I thought these NPCs were unique to the Burning of Teldrassil event. Still, I think I updated all the current problematic ones. It's probably OK to split the Orgrimmar Grunt page ... Xporc (talk) 10:02, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Oki. And keep those silly comments to yourself, I'm not interested in them :* --Mordecay (talk) 10:09, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

If you're not happy about them, then maybe don't do errors :^) Xporc (talk) 11:31, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

They weren't errors, it was u being hasty. --Mordecay (talk) 11:36, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Quest2 elinks

Always nice with more templates, simplifying stuff like that. One thing though. I don't really mind either, but I think it'd be good to use the same words in the "loc=" parameters. On the template example you have "Cataclysm & Pre-Cataclysm" but here you use "Cataclysm & Original". Again, I'm fine with either, but sticking to one, would be good. PeterWind (talk) 00:25, 6 June 2018 (UTC)

NPC, quests formatting and value to visitors

FYI there are more than 50.0000 NPCs on wowpedia and around 20.000 quests, at least that's what I gathered at a quick glance. Why am I saying that so suddenly? Well, because it seems you've recently become fixated on trying to fix all the NPCs and quests you come across, with moving around template parameters and capitalizing templates that already works. I don't mind when you edit values that actually change something on the final page new quests, new links, etc., but we are currently discussing among the admin team how trying to fix all the NPC pages one come across just to make sure they fit some sort of template isn't really worth anyone's time ... or health. So next time you are in such a situation, please try to think about wether what you are doing is really worth it.

BTW I know you're gonna tell me you're not the only one doing it, but you were also the one telling PeterWind to clutter less the Recent Changes list the other day Xporc (talk) 11:22, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, I specifically targeted those "for" & "distinguish" templates now because I haven't been around when the pages were created so I could not edit them then (+ they go on top by default in wikis as previously discussed with Gourra) and because of that the RC page looks bloated now as I want to catch up. I'm aware that capitalizing parameters have no real impact, but I'm doing it in addition to other tweaks that have impact in result so no harm done. --Mordecay (talk) 11:41, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Some of your edits like this one have no impacts on the end page. Just make sure not to overdo it ... and I say that for you as well. Since a few months my arms are in pain because of too much clicking and editing on wowpedia, and even taking breaks don't really fix them :/ This didn't happen when I was younger and/or spent more time doing something else than wiki work. Now I'm considering whether it was all worth it or not. Xporc (talk)

You are getting old, granpda. --Mordecay (talk) 12:11, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Sure am. Xporc (talk) 12:15, 7 June 2018 (UTC)

Dude, you changed half a page] for nothing. I am seriously considering retiring from my position if all my days onward are just gonna be validating these kind of edits :/ Xporc (talk) 23:57, 8 June 2018 (UTC)

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ --Mordecay (talk) 00:14, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

If you could only do this updates when you change something necessary from the page that'd be helpful. Otherwise this means too much unnecessary work for xporc. We all would be grateful if you complied. --Ryon21 (talk) 00:22, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

In this specific example, the point was to remove the quotation marks as they shouldn't be there. Aside from that, I did the parameters as well so... --Mordecay (talk) 00:26, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

In that case why not just remove the quotation marks? It's literally the only parameter showing up on the end page. Honestly, you are _never_ going to "correct" the code of all of the 50.000 NPCs on wowpedia, and are only hurting yourself/other editors by doing this.

Anyway, in the past few days I tried to give sincere advice instead of saying it plainly, but know that some people in the administration team are considering that your behavior is currently on the fence with Project:DE and that in the past, some people (including Surafbrov, who can witness here) were officially told to stop this kind of edits because honestly they don't bring anything but annoyance. Xporc (talk) 00:55, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Hmm, in my defense, I guess, I don't "always" and "just" edit the parameters but I create new pages add new things into pages, as well as edit small things (and parameters on top of that) especially in these days. As I said I was out for 2 - 3 weeks so ofc I was and will be editing like a madman before limiting myself again. But just to be clear, what exactly is supposed to be disruptive? --Mordecay (talk) 01:02, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Okay, back after a lot of needed sleep. Sorry if I sounded hysterical yesterday, but this wiki really is driving me crazy.

So don't take this wrong, when you create new pages or add new info you are basically one of our top editors, and even on the top 10 editors list of the whole gamepedia network. That is good, very good, and I believe everyone here is thankful for that.

However you also do edits like "{{npcbox" to "{{Npcbox", "{{aggro|1|1" to "{{Aggro|1|1", "{{elinks|xxx" to "{{Elinks|xxx", reordering the "|status=Killable" parameter to put it at the end of a template when it's in the middle, etc. All of these are changes that are really, really, minor, have no effect on the page that is actually seen by the end user, and that clutter very heavily the Recent Changes list. Now this shouldn't be too much of a problem, however ...

For more than two years now, I've watched over the Recent Changes. This used to originally be a fun and short job that only took a couple of hours of my days, that I gladly did and then moved on to do more interesting things, like adding new content to the site or playing a video game. However in the last year the amount of daily edits on wowpedia exploded, it takes me half of my days now to even keep up with the Recent Changes. Between my RL job and wowpedia, some days I work up to 14+ hours in a row. Just today, I woke up an hour ago and I already have 500 edits to validate, which will take me hours, and when I'm done with it there will be even more edits to validate. The crazy amount of work is slowly burning me out, which I already tried to explain some months ago, and is now even getting problematic for my health. My arms have been in pain for the last couple of months now, because of too much clicking around :/ I also can't take time for myself to do stuff like trying to find a new house or seeing my IRL friends more.

This leads me to being eternally tired and cranky, with the following results:

The frequency at which I am lashing out at people because of that is increasing, leading me to slowly destroy the nice friendships I built here over the last two years. I don't want that. I don't want to yell at you, MWWQ, PeterWind or Surafbrov, because deep down you're all nice people.
I take no pleasure anymore in visiting wowpedia (because I am afraid of the RC page) or launching world of warcraft (because archiving everything that is gonna soon disappear is too much work).
I have to leave personal projects behind because the above takes too much time already.
I don't want you or anyone else to end up like me, with arm injuries and regrets over time being wasted.

Sorry for the wall of text. The TL;DR is this: I am a very tired man and something must change; either people editing more responsibly or me stopping to watch over the RC page and possibly leaving wowpedia entirely. Today for the first time ever I'll also just try to ignore the RC page ... Xporc (talk) 10:10, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Random watchers

These random watchers are very clearly not supposed to be Watchers, a different organization, they are guards. It is pointless and serves literally no purpose to say "there are watchers aka guards that are not Watchers". -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:13, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Given they are night elves with the title, it is interesting to note. --Mordecay (talk) 20:16, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

I just don't think that is the case, they are just guards. It's a very common synonym. It's kind of worded like some sort of inconsistency, that they're watchers but don't look like Watchers. Yet that's because they are not supposed to be Watchers, they're just guards. I just don't see the point of this, it doesn't seem like it's adding any value to the page, I don't think anyone will read this and feel smarter for having read that guards are occasionally called watchers. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:19, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Again, agreed on the part that they are just guards and not part of the Watchers. That's what the note says. Those 3 (+ one more) are the only night elves to use that title. That's noteworthy. --Mordecay (talk) 20:22, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

I just don't think it is noteworthy to say there are (night elf) watchers/guards who are obviously not Watchers, they're Cenarion guards. It's not even a title actually, it's a profession/job, like "guard". Meanwhile "Watcher" (as in part of the Watchers) is a title. Does it really add value to the page, is the question. Or is it just a tangentially related note that serves little purpose ? It's trying to "point out" something that obviously does not need pointing out. Next we're going to point out that night elf guards are not actually part of Moon Guard, that Stormwind guards are not part of the Royal Guard, and so on. Or do we assume the readers are already aware of those facts or smart enough to not confuse some random guards with completely different organizations. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:31, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

I think that yea, because it gives their existence to readers, that something like this actually happens in the night elf lore. The term "Watcher" actually refers to a job as well. Wolfheart: "That is nothing! Jarod, I have remained true to my duties as a protector of the night elf race from the moment I became a priestess of Elune, and afterward as a Watcher, until even now!" or "She would have made a good Watcher." --Mordecay (talk) 20:48, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Yes, but Watcher (as in, part of the Watchers) is a title. Being a guard is not. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:53, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

"The Wardens are only referred to as Wardens"

Stop one second and think about the meaning of that sentence, and tell me how it is not silly. Yes, Wardens are called "Wardens". Nothing weird about that.

And no there is no contradiction or inconsistency between the audio-drama and Legion. Wardens are Watchers, so every mention of a Warden is a mention of a Watcher. That and the fact that there literally is an entire Isle of the Watchers, and that Maiev is called "Leader of the Watchers" on the Legion website, so they did not forget about the Watchers. It's just that we deal with the rep faction called "The Wardens". -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:16, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, wardens are Watchers, but the Watcher term itself is not used anywhere in any dialogue or quest in Legion, except the mention of the Isle of the Watchers. --Mordecay (talk) 20:22, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

That's because you deal with Wardens. So they are called Wardens. How is that an inconsistency ?

And the term Watcher is used, there is an entire subzone called Isle of the Watchers, and Maiev is called Leader of the Watchers on her website page. So when you say that the term Watcher is not used, you are wrong. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:26, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

I just literally said >>>in Legion besides the Isle<<<< - in the >>>game<<<'s >>>quests<<< and >>>quotes<<<, so I am correct. The speculation section lists all things, how the terms are used, so how the term is not used shouldn't hurt. It being not used in quests is a fact and a statement which readers may or may not interpret however they like. --Mordecay (talk) 20:33, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

I'm not sure you understand what an inconsistency is. There is nothing inconsistent or weird or wrong about Wardens being called Wardens instead of Watchers.

And "in the game, quests and quotes" you deal with Wardens, so they are referred to as Wardens. Similarly when I do quests for Stormwind Guards they are referred to as Stormwind Guards, because the quest is given by a Stormwind Guard, and it's a Stormwind Guard who speaks.

You've been doing a lot of "Bronzedragon" things lately, adding random/insignificant/"obviously obvious" "notes" and "inconsistencies" to pages. This is not an inconsistency and there's nothing weird about it. -- MyMindWontQuiet 20:39, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Sure, if you say so. --Mordecay (talk) 20:45, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

I just won't let your edit through. It's silly to remark that the Wardens are not called Watchers. That is because they are Wardens.

And as said earlier, there's an entire island called Isle of the Watchers, Maiev is called Leader of the Watchers, and there are multiple Owl of the Watchers statues scattered around. So they did not forget about the term Watcher. -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:03, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Vplayer tag

Don't remove these, they are used to play videos under the section. That it puts an extra empty line is a bug. --g0urra[T҂C] 22:03, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Oki, sorry for that. --Mordecay (talk) 22:04, 10 June 2018 (UTC)

Before The Storm pages

Hey Mordecay, is there anyway to communicate with you over discord to discuss topics regarding Before The Storm so I don't step on your toes? TeamRemix (talk) 01:49, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

Hey, feel free to edit in any capacity you feel it. --Mordecay (talk) 01:53, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

Nazmani insects

Is there any reason to believe that the beetles are affiliated with the blood troll tribe, and not just named for the region? I have not read the quests for this area, so it could well be the case. As they are neutral, I am a bit sceptical, but I wouldn't know. PeterWind (talk) 22:29, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Wouldn't they be called Zul'Nazman <beetle name> if they were just named after the location? --Mordecay (talk) 22:34, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Maybe? Well, if the area is named after the tribe, then it's probably fine listing the tribe as affiliation. PeterWind (talk) 23:07, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Item characters

Nice initiative! It's something I've wanted to take a look at myself, somewhere down the line. Is the premise just any character mentioned by name in items, but found nowhere else? Would you mind if I added names I came across myself? If this is a "private" project, that's cool too! PeterWind (talk) 21:37, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Yep, referenced in item names or their flavor texts and found nowhere else in Warcraft (excluding the two RPG characters that are referenced by a legendary item, coz that's special). Feel free to expand it. --Mordecay (talk) 21:45, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Right. I'll add ones I think to be relevant and you can remove any you feel might not fit the bill. PeterWind (talk) 21:50, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

Map Room

It's been referred to as the Map room by Anduin himself and has been referred to in the same name in previous novels. If it's being referred to as the same name more than once that officiates it for me. I didn't see it referred to War Room anywhere else until you added a source but whatever it's all just trivial semantics.(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 16:24, 26 June 2018 (UTC))

What I am saying is that it is referred to as the map room not the Map room or Map Room. --Mordecay (talk) 16:27, 26 June 2018 (UTC)

Kil'jaeden

Moved to Talk:Eredar#Kil'jaeden's palace

Valeera Sanguinar Before the Storm

Do you know which chapter she also appears in?(Sports72Xtrm (talk) 16:30, 11 July 2018 (UTC))

Oh, sorry, I am blind! It's all there :-D --Mordecay (talk) 16:31, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

Darnassian main space names

Should the scenario NPCs take priority over uninstanced NPCs? The ones in Stormwind are the first encountered, to my knowledge. PeterWind (talk) 13:40, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

I originally thought they should be on one page as in the Stormwind Extraction they are specifically stated to be the ones that participated in Lordaeron. But seeing how they have different armor - File:Darnassian Archer (Stormwind).jpg & File:Darnassian Archer.jpg - they should probably be left split. Now for the namespaces, no hard opinion, but maaaybe the first Stormwind ones should take priority, have no parenthesis, as they can be seen regularly now ("always") and the ones in the scenario are just seen during that one time.

Edit: Well unless that Lordaeron pic is ood, that is. If they will look the same in live servers, I think that with proper stats and categories, they can all be in one page, maybe. It's just a question of whether we want one page for all or separate NPC pages for different locations. I would prefer, if they have the same name but are really that different, look-wise, stat-wise, ability-wise, quote-wise, to have different pages. --Mordecay (talk) 13:49, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Looking through some of the models, it seems quite a few different looks are used. I think the Lordaeron ones are updated to use the skimpier sentinel armor. Yet, some of the Darkshore ones in 8.0.1 use the older standard outfit.. I'll leave this one as is for now I think. I'll probably take another look once the scenario is available. PeterWind (talk) 14:08, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

Blizz employees

Blizzard employees nicknames usually redirect to the employee's page, like Ythisens > Caden House, Ornyx > Brett Forbus, Drawgoon > Peter Lee, and so on. Rygarius is an exception here and clearly not the rule, and perhaps one that may need to be fixed especially since the NPC is named after him.. (edit: in fact it looks like it was Mondoblasto who decided to move them around for some reason, instead of disambiguating, contradicting the convention..) but at least there's no reason to move the other page. -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:34, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Neither of these are NPCs in the game, but seeing how Mumper works, then it's ok, I guess. So should ~~Rygarius]~~ and Phalanx pages be moved so that they could be redirects to the dudes, for consistency? --Mordecay (talk) 21:51, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

Sure, I'll take care of it. :P -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:54, 23 July 2018 (UTC)

"A pic in the left???? :-DDD"

I know, I know.. but I really saw no other way, it's what looks the closest to a "real" window, and without "|left", one of the two pics will either largely exceed the page's length, or have to be put in a tiny gallery. :P -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:39, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Sometimes pictures in the left are okay. I don't think there's the need to put all of them to the right since then it looks overwhelmed. Sorry to spam :) --Ryon21 (talk) 23:43, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Sometimes, yes, but these still break the "To unlock this race" points for me. Thoughts? --Mordecay (talk) 23:53, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

In those cases I go with the gallery :/ --Ryon21 (talk) 23:55, 26 July 2018 (UTC)

Does it still break ? Shouldn't. -- MyMindWontQuiet 00:33, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

Doesn't. --Mordecay (talk) 00:39, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

Could you do it on the other pages as well, User:MyMindWontQuiet? --Mordecay (talk) 20:13, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

Yup planning to-- MyMindWontQuiet 18:42, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Pic

The artist herself said it was commissioned by Blizzard. You can her yourself (on Reddit for example, /u/sandara3), like I did. The twitter account likely either mistyped or meant it as "made by a fan and not an in-house artist". -- MyMindWontQuiet 13:10, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Hmmm, it's just that Blizzard post fanarts constantly on their social medias, but if the author says so, then it's ok, I guess. --Mordecay (talk) 13:13, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

The thing is that they do not state "hey we had this made by X for us" themselves, they'll just post the art and expect people to assume it's official since it was posted on the official twitter account. And it technically does make sense. But yeah you need to ask or check the artist's page to get an explicit "word" for it. It was the exact same situation for the class mount series they commissioned across dozens of artists.. they'd just say "done by X".

They also posted a mini Teldrassil comic strip a few days ago, I'm assuming it's a commission as well but haven't verified yet. -- MyMindWontQuiet 13:23, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

I honestly never thought Blizzard would expect us to assume the art they post is "official" and not "just fanart". I found Sava and Nystrom, but what's Tang's source? On reddit, I found that they didn't know the event is called War of the Thorns? --Mordecay (talk) 13:31, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Goblin Hotfix

Any idea who this "Hotfix" goblin is? Wowhead has nothing on this name. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 11:29, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

A Traveler character. --Mordecay (talk) 11:30, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 11:34, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

And another thanks for building up the information for the article! I don't have that book yet :( — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 11:51, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

No problem :-D --Mordecay (talk) 11:53, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Antialiasing

Hey! Can you crank up the antialiasing when taking screenshots in the future? No need to go back and retake any screenshots, but it does look a bit nicer with that setting on :) PeterWind (talk) 11:39, 4 August 2018 (UTC)

Ok. Thx for the tip. --Mordecay (talk) 12:02, 4 August 2018 (UTC)

100k

Gratz for the 100k edits ! -- MyMindWontQuiet 00:02, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Now onto 100k more! --Mordecay (talk) 00:09, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

Grats! Good job on the War of the Thorns pages too! PeterWind (talk) 03:06, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

Todah rabah :) --Mordecay (talk) 11:53, 5 August 2018 (UTC)

Congratz! :D — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 14:55, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Thx. --Mordecay (talk) 16:43, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Paintings

So I've started the journey for them. I took all the ones found at Photonic Playground, although I did mark some as cleanup because a better angle would be better.. especially for one of them that is stored in a small corner. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 14:55, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Very nice. Uploaded new versions of the tagged ones, except File:Photonic Playground Painting16.jpg. --Mordecay (talk) 16:43, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Nice and thanks for the new versions! I'll see if I can find painting 16 in WMV. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 16:50, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, or maybe some different location other than the Dalaran shop. I could imagine it being totally a Black Rook Hold painting :-D --Mordecay (talk) 17:03, 7 August 2018 (UTC)

"The wording is slightly different in the book"

A cinematic scene is about 30 seconds long, in a book it's multiple pages, so most of the time the same scene will have a few more words or sentences in the book than the cinematic. This is naturally expected. It's the same thing as when the same region (for example Tirisfal) has slightly differently positioned trees in-game than it does in art or in cinematics, or sometimes there's a random house or street in this artwork that's not in that other artwork, or the towers of Dalaran that are not exactly positioned or sized the same. So I think we should stop with these types of comments, all of this is normal and expected, it's not actually a "retcon or inconsistency". This counts more as the same, expected, normal fluff that we don't usually point out because there's nothing to point out, it depicts the exact same thing. -- MyMindWontQuiet 21:49, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Nah, if there is a difference section (or retcons and inconsistencies sections) on a page, there's nothing wrong with listing all differences. I agree that differences in different materials are to be expected, but it isn't pointless to list and show WHERE the difference is. Some may want to see that (as it may have been overlooked or forgotten by the reader) while others may not. But it should be listed to show where the difference is. --Mordecay (talk) 22:06, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Disagree, there is a point when it becomes useless. It's the exact same reason we don't point out that Dalaran does not always have the exact same number of towers, or that some trees present in the Teldrassil artwork are not there in the cinematic. Or hell, Teldrassil's shape itself varies from artwork to artwork, but this is obvious by just looking at the pics with your eyes. It is (more) interesting to point out stuff like 'The Legion epilogue cinematic is depicted / also takes place in the X novella', but stuff like 'Anduin says maybe 3 more words' or 'Shaw uses a slightly different wording' or 'Sylvanas used the present tense here instead of a preterit', you understand that's silly. -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:34, 9 August 2018 (UTC)

Oh, we should totally list those! Thanks for an idea! --Mordecay (talk) 00:26, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Standby

Was looking at some ask cdevs, noticed you were the one who asked about Castillian from the Ashbringer comics, and they said that "We certainly have not seen the last of Castillian".. still waiting. -- MyMindWontQuiet 02:32, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Poor Raac, just vanishing without a trace, probably never to be seen again. --Mordecay (talk) 11:15, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Dentaria Silverglade and her nightsaber

Hey! Currently I see that Striped Nightsaber is a redirect, but per the location of this kitty cat, it could be that this is the name of her mount, as she has an appearance right next to it as seen here. PeterWind (talk) 18:26, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Oh, if it's a separate NPC, then yeah, it should have page. --Mordecay (talk) 18:37, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Stormwind Priest (Stormwind City)

Hey! The second ID (125124) for Stormwind Priest (Stormwind City) is also used for the priests in the Battle for Lordaeron. PeterWind (talk) 21:34, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Hmm, interesting. ~~What's the procedure here? One page for both (Stormwind & Lordaeron) or split into two?~~ Only the first ID is used in Stormwind, probably put all three there by mistake. --Mordecay (talk) 21:39, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Yeah I wasn't sure either so I figured I'd get your take on the situation. Haha yeah well that happens. PeterWind (talk) 23:06, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

"Page" vs "pg."

Is there a particular reason for why you sometimes change book refs to state "pg. <number>" instead of "page <number>" (like here and here), when you also formatted the Chronicle reference templates (such as {{Ref WoWCV1}}) to state "page"? I wouldn't mind adjusting to one over the other, but I'm just curious about the reasoning. -- DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 23:24, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

I think that wikipedia (well, not sure about other wikis) prefers abbreviations of "page" in references and neither "p." or "pp." are used here so "pg." it is, and so I automatically change them when I see it. I created those Chronicle ref templates by copying a similar one, and I actually once tried to change it to show "pg." instead of "page", but I did not managed to make it properly work :-D

Looking at Wowpedia guideline examples, I don't see "page" (or "pg.") there, but I think having the abbreviations there look more... standard? --Mordecay (talk) 23:40, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

I see. I'll stick to using "pg." then! --

DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 23:49, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Heh, cool! --Mordecay (talk) 23:55, 10 August 2018 (UTC)

Just to add my spices to this topic, I think "pg." looks particularly better for references. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 23:54, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

And I see you also changed the Chronicle templates very easily :-D --Mordecay (talk) 00:35, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Depleted Nether Crystal

For this quest, and the ones I added, there is a considdereable discrepancy between how Wowhead and WoWDB presents it. WoWDB lists these quests as being started by the items rather than being rewards from the quests. I went with what WoWDB said in the other cases, but I can't honestly say for sure. PeterWind (talk) 23:38, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Hmm, looking at the quest objectives, it does look like those items start the quests rather than being rewarded. --Mordecay (talk) 00:35, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

For whatever reason, I can't access the armory links from home. Do the items show up there, and do they provide any hints? PeterWind (talk) 09:34, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

The armory says the same thing as wowhead, the item being a reward from those rfptr quests. But

[45] Legion Threat: Azshara (and the other Legion Threat quests) says on the armory and wowhead that

[Depleted Nether Crystal] is also rewarded from this. --Mordecay (talk) 11:39, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Hmm.. Seems odd, as most quests talk as if they follow the same procefure. Item drops from demons, and you take the item to Dalaran.. Guess there's no way of knowing for sure. PeterWind (talk) 12:13, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

Crimper Mirjam

I saw the old screenshot on wowhead. It's probably fine to add that bit. One problem is though, that we have no way of telling if the old model had the same name as the current ID :( PeterWind (talk) 15:20, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

Yes. --Mordecay (talk) 15:37, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

Fact

I asked Suraf to enhance your preferred means of communication and he kindly proceeded to add an argument to the {{fact}} template, now you don't have to use {{fact}} anymore ! -- MyMindWontQuiet 17:20, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

How thoughtful! Thanks, Suraf! --Mordecay (talk) 17:26, 17 August 2018 (UTC)

Azerite fragments and quest rewards

If you can point me to an actual [Small Azerite Fragment] item in-game, please let me know. Neither of the databases seem to suggest the "item" actually exists, and that it's more a fragment of the quest log's imagination.

I'd prefer to show something useful to readers rather than an article that will always be red-linked. --k_d³ 05:03, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

True, they are not real items that go into bags as they only appear in the quest logs and as soon as a quest rewarding them is completed, they automatically transform into X amount of Azerite. That doesn't mean they can't have pages here. They can be transcribed directly from the game, they just won't have External links section, just like several objects (Escape Rope) that don't have IDs and External links. We have pages for stuff (Category :Followers icon) that don't appear anywhere in the game (or more specifically, players can never see them in the game) and we even use those as sources here. As such, I think pages that appear in the game, albeit briefly, should have their own pages. --Mordecay (talk) 10:09, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

As I recall, the "item" can be clicked in the chatlog and does have a flavortext describing the amount of azerite they provide. PeterWind (talk) 11:31, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

The only difference, the Artifact Power in BfA compared to Legion is that it is automatically earned instead of you having to right click and wait a second or two on each one. As per those Azerite Fragments, IMO, I would prefer those articles be created as they do display some kind of flavortext on the amount of azerite is provided, just as Peter said.— SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 11:54, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Ok, but are we going to have ~30 versions of

[Small Azerite Fragment] that shows how much AP is rewarded? How are readers going to tell at a glance how much AP a quest reward provides? --k_d³ 18:20, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

I think something like that should be handled on the quest article itself while the item articles have X as a placeholder of it. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 18:23, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

I saw different types of these items based on how much Azerite Power they reward. Is one item giving different amount of AP a thing? --Mordecay (talk) 20:14, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Yea. An example of this would be World Quests giving the same item, different amount of AP. (Dungeon World Quests are a different item however). — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 20:55, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Are those AP gains different on different levels? Lets say quest X awards item Y with 100 AP on level 111 but X awards Y with 100,000 AP on level 119. Is this a thing or nah? --Mordecay (talk) 22:27, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

I didn't see an increase in AP rewards as I went from level 110 to 120. I would think there is a minimum and maximum that the item gives, then some that are a static amount (Like that weekly Island expeditions quest giving 2500 AP) — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 22:32, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

So I went ahead and created Category:Azerite items for these items so as they get created, we have a easy place to make edits to them if needed. I'm gonna go ahead and start creating them as I quest from level 110 to 120 on my DH. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 05:02, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

I wonder if all the ones with same name but different values, are actually different, or if Blizz made some tech or bonusID line that will just alter amount/flavor. PeterWind (talk) 06:13, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Moonblade

Hey! One of the way in which Wowhead can be anoying at times is that "interactive objects" don't normally show up in search results. The blade can be found here though! :) PeterWind (talk) 22:15, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

Ok yeah nvm I'm blind. This one actually does show up in regular search. PeterWind (talk) 22:17, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

Oh, I should have searched it through the search bar, instead of just looking at the link in the objective section on Wowhead. Thanks for noticing it! --Mordecay (talk) 22:21, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

That existed?! *Checks Deadmines objects again* Edit: Still don't have them all! ;) — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 22:24, 20 August 2018 (UTC)

Clatterback

The "avoidable" note was mostly just a joke, pertaining to the function of this mob. It has an immense amount of hp, oneshots just about everyone and is only encountered when solving the secret. I've not done the last steps yet, but so far it is easy to go and get killed by it, but you don't actually have to get close to it :) PeterWind (talk) 06:08, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Fair enough :-D --Mordecay (talk) 11:43, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

The Heart's Power

So, [120] The Heart's Power was available for me from Magni but I'm not sure what the requirements are to unlock this quest. Any idea?

also this [Silithus Portal Stone] is a reward from it according to Wowhead, but I didn't get it.
P.S, you should archive most of your talk page. ;)

— SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 01:40, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

I think I may have solved it with this comment. But the stone still is questionable. — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 01:57, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Haven't got the quest yet. However, I've noticed that Wowhead has a new bug - it lists quest items that you use during quests as a reward too. For example,

[10-60] Growing Pains on Wowhead lists

[Direhorn Growth Hormone] as its reward when in the game, it's not a reward. If you didn't get the stone during the quest, it is also possible that the stone is provided during the the other max-level quests or that it is cut from the game entirely. Other than that, I will keep an extra eye on those quests and the item when I get them. --Mordecay (talk) 10:40, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Judging from the recent hotfixes, it's triggered by getting Friendly with the Champions of Azeroth. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 10:48, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Bilgewater Sabotage

Is that the correct reward for Bilgewater Sabotage? It's not what I'm seeing on Wowhead. PeterWind (talk) 13:30, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Looks like Kandooww copied the

Ancient Magic page and reworked it into Bilgewater Sabotage without changing the Rewards and Gains sections. --Mordecay (talk) 13:35, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Oh duh right! It wasn't even your doing. I just checked the disambig page and left it at that :) PeterWind (talk) 23:33, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

World maps

If you ever come across out-of-date maps, just let me know and I'll update it asap. :P — SurafbrovWarcraft Wiki administrator T / C 15:58, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

K. --Mordecay (talk) 16:09, 24 August 2018 (UTC)

Better name

Hey, can we think of a better section-name than "Retcons & discrepancies" for our pages ? It's a bit misleading and it can be hard at times, specially for big stuff like Chronicle books, to guess what is a simple mistake/oversight, what is an inconsistency, and what is an actual retcon. And even then, a lot of time it's not really our job to say which is what. What about "Discrepancies" ? -- MyMindWontQuiet 16:09, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Sure. Several pages also use the word inconsistencies, so it could probably use some unification. However, I think the word retcon is also important to list at least in the chronicles as they described the importance on its canonicity - sometimes it is clear that something is a retcon. Take for example the Aegwynn backstory from the first manuals. Would you want to call that a discrepancy, or rather use a more correct term? Where I'm heading with this is that how Chronicle 3 has that section divided into three subsections is a good idea to add to pages that contain a long list of those things. So discrepancies could work as section name, but further divide it nto three subsections in the chronicles. Mordecay (talk) 17:45, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Yeah we can still use the subsections as long as we're really sure something is indeed a retcon, I meant more for the mother-section. Another suggestion could be "Continuity" ? Since "discrepancy" kind of has that connotation that it's unintentional, but as you said retcons can be very much intended. -- MyMindWontQuiet 22:51, 27 August 2018 (UTC)

Continuity sounds also interesting, but would its meaning hint towards the topics of discrepancies and mistakes? Thinking of it, the word also kinda opens a way to add additional notes about connections or mentions of other works (as in Alleria in BtS mentioning the events of the Three Sisters comic or Anduin mentioning the events of the Shattering, but I'm not sure now if this kind of things is something that should be done.) --Mordecay (talk) 16:02, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

I have seen other wikis use Continuity for retcons/inconsistencies sections. This is what "retcon" refers to technically, "retroactive continuity". :P

I'm also thinking of having one such section for expansion articles. We could put things there like Derek's body being retconned (in the novels his body was burned by the dragons), Kul Tiras' shape/position, etc.-- MyMindWontQuiet 20:02, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

If inconsistencies and mistakes are on other wikis under a Continuity section, then it should be OK here as well. --Mordecay (talk) 20:21, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Shuga Blastcaps & Myxle

Hey! When listing Myxle "The Searat" Gutwrench and Shuga Blastcaps as being affiliated with the Bilgewater Cartel, is that just because they are Horde goblins? I do not see the NPCs being members of the faction. PeterWind (talk) 17:25, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Ah, I remember these two. The shop they are in has the Bilgewater banner - File:Searat's Volitile Valuables.jpg. --Mordecay (talk) 17:34, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

Right right :) PeterWind (talk) 18:21, 30 August 2018 (UTC)

[1] Thrall: Twilight of the Aspects

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